Terri (I will call her Terri has she asked me to keep her private), suggested I write about two questions she had about Ashtanga Yoga in particular and that originated from a recent Facebook post, done by a studio, in which they announced they would be holding a teacher training on Ashtanga Yoga. The post sparked some controversy. Here are the two interesting questions from Terri and my answers:
It depends on how you interpret "Ashtanga".
The word Ashtanga means "eight limbs" as was described by that old sage Patanjali in chapter two of his two-thousand year-old Yoga Sutras, (a book that is like the "bible" of yoga) and it is not propriety of anyone on the planet as far as I know.
Therefore if we look at it from the perspective of Patanjali, that of teaching the eight limbs of yoga then yes, any studio can teach this, and I would hope that is what most studios are indeed teaching, although I have made it known in this blog how I feel that pranayama and meditation are missing from many a teacher training.
The Eight Limbs of Yoga is the focus of this blog for example, although I do zero-in mostly on the system of Pattabhi Jois for asanas as I have not found anything to be more effective for me when it comes to how the yoga poses are approached (daily practice, 6 times a week, series that grow in challenging difficulty, flexibility being in the mind, etc). Pattabhi Jois's system has magic.
This daily asana practice works very well with my own nervous system, but if you look into the blog you will see that, for example, for pranayama (the fourth limb of yoga) I look to many other sources, and for meditation (the sixth limb) I also work with other resources.
HOWEVER, it is a very different story if you mean that you will be training teachers in the Ashtanga Vinyasa System of Pattabhi Jois.
Now, of course, there is a bit of an issue here too, because Manju Jois, who is the son of Pattabhi Jois and who has been teaching Ashtanga Vinyasa Yoga for over 40 years, does offer "Teacher Training's".
Manju gives them internationally throughout the year and not in India specifically or in any relation to the institute, matter of fact he is running one today in Hawaii, and he has more coming up in the near future.
I feel that the real dishonoring would be not to practice.
It is through our own investigations of ourselves that we get real about what works for us, what helps us stop the time travelling and instead embodying this moment as the eternal and only existence there is.
The rest is not necessary.
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Do you have questions? Send them! follow me on Twitter or Leave them in the comments.
1) Should any studio be training Ashtanga Yoga Teachers? (Other than the Ashtanga Yoga Research Institute in India)?
The word Ashtanga means "eight limbs" as was described by that old sage Patanjali in chapter two of his two-thousand year-old Yoga Sutras, (a book that is like the "bible" of yoga) and it is not propriety of anyone on the planet as far as I know.
Therefore if we look at it from the perspective of Patanjali, that of teaching the eight limbs of yoga then yes, any studio can teach this, and I would hope that is what most studios are indeed teaching, although I have made it known in this blog how I feel that pranayama and meditation are missing from many a teacher training.
The Eight Limbs of Yoga is the focus of this blog for example, although I do zero-in mostly on the system of Pattabhi Jois for asanas as I have not found anything to be more effective for me when it comes to how the yoga poses are approached (daily practice, 6 times a week, series that grow in challenging difficulty, flexibility being in the mind, etc). Pattabhi Jois's system has magic.
This daily asana practice works very well with my own nervous system, but if you look into the blog you will see that, for example, for pranayama (the fourth limb of yoga) I look to many other sources, and for meditation (the sixth limb) I also work with other resources.
HOWEVER, it is a very different story if you mean that you will be training teachers in the Ashtanga Vinyasa System of Pattabhi Jois.
If someone is to teach Ashtanga Vinyasa Yoga as per Pattabhi Jois, then no, it would not be right to do so, because the institute itself says that teachers are only authorized in India and by them.
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| Pattabhi Jois (left) and Manju, father and son |
In general, for the Ashtanga Vinyasa Yoga System of Pattabhi Jois, and when it comes to authorizing teachers, I would stick to "the family".
I have met wonderful teachers who have only been trained by either Sharath / Saraswati or only by Manju, and they are dedicated, experienced people. There are also people who study with both.
I have seen Manju asking his senior students "Are you teaching"? And this is because he knows how important the practice is, how valuable and how transforming it is, and my guess is he wants it to spread it.
As per certified teachers whom you may find around who do offer the "authorization", if you look at the fine print, you will see that non of them offers an "ashtanga" authorization, but rather what they offer is the qualification to be part of the "registry" of the Yoga Alliance, which is an American Organization that does very little to verify the validity of their teachers.
2) Am I dishonoring the true lineage of Ashtanga Yoga as taught by Pattabhi Jois by taking classes with unauthorized teachers?
I feel that the real dishonoring would be not to practice.
I cannot speak for you but I will tell you about me, I did. When I first started practicing I did so with a teacher who was not authorized by India that I know of, or was not at the time.
Teachers are people, and sometimes need to survive and feed families, and some are not able to travel to India for 3 months every 18 months, that does not mean they are bad teachers.
Teachers are people, and sometimes need to survive and feed families, and some are not able to travel to India for 3 months every 18 months, that does not mean they are bad teachers.
The real question is finding a good teacher, and in this tradition it is my experience that good teachers have put in the time with their own teachers, maintain a rigorous daily practice, and continue to advance their understanding and practice of yoga in all levels of life.
In general I try to find authorized or certified teachers who have studied either with Sharath and Saraswati or with Manju.
But if they are not available and I see a class with non-accredited teachers and I am in a foreign land wishing to practice, then I would give it a try anyway, see how I feel, see if I can trust the teacher, see if I feel like I am comfortable with the level of experience they have, if they can offer me proper adjustments, if they live how they preach, if it feels right.
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| Saraswati and Sharath, mother and son |
But if they are not available and I see a class with non-accredited teachers and I am in a foreign land wishing to practice, then I would give it a try anyway, see how I feel, see if I can trust the teacher, see if I feel like I am comfortable with the level of experience they have, if they can offer me proper adjustments, if they live how they preach, if it feels right.
For me it all comes down with how I feel on that Mysore room. Is the program serious? Is the teacher dedicated? Is he or she someone I "feel" (gut feeling is important) I can trust? Can I talk to him or her? Do they answer with good responses? Do I enjoy it? Can the teacher take NO for an answer? for example if something hurts I would not want a teacher to force me into a position.
Just like you say, if we all went only to authorized or certified teachers many of us would have no yoga studio nearby, and that would be sad. Some groups of people that find themselves in this position have even began experimenting by renting a room in which people "practice together", like they do Las Vegas.
There are also plenty of resources to start with, DVDs from experienced teachers, even the web.
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| Las Vegas solved the problem nicely. Click on the image to go to the group |
Finally, more and more I realize that the journey of yoga is one that is very VERY personal, it has a lot more to do with questions that we ask ourselves, like the ones you are asking, and in getting to know us, what we respect, where we draw the line, where our own mythology takes us.
The rest is not necessary.
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Do you have questions? Send them! follow me on Twitter or Leave them in the comments.
There is a difference between teacher training for authorization and teacher training to give them tools. I don't have a problem with the concept of teacher training. My problem is using it as a a money making method and letting any Tom, Dick and Harry into the program. If a person has an Ashtanga studio, even if they are authorized, they need people to sub for them when they are sick or traveling to Mysore. If they do a training program for this reason or to expand class offerings and they are picky about who they let in, then no problem.
ReplyDeleteBeing a student of Lino I strongly feel that your teacher should be the one who tells you when you're ready to teach ashtanga.
ReplyDeleteLino doesn't certify or "authorize" formally anyone be he will tell you when you're ready and train you to do adjustments.
Like you said the most important is finding a good teacher, and also that he/she respect the lineage and tradition. The piece of paper means little and certainly not that you have the skills, the dedication and the love for practice and students.
On the other hand I feel it's unrealistic to pretend that only AYRI India can train ashtanga teachers. Mysore is far, inconvenient for many people, crowded and with little personal interaction with Sharath or Saraswati. Their insistance on AYRI certificates is more a way to preserve business than lineage in my opinion...
I also feel that contrary to man other styles ashtangi are respectful of lineage and training is rather consistent and omogenous.
I'm glad you wrote on this. I have had such a time with this, mainly because there are not certified instructors near me but there is a woman who teaches a led class up north of where I live. It's actually where I went to my first Ashtanga "class" versus private practice.
ReplyDeleteI see your point. Well taken. We do live in the real world and there is a need for people to adjust, to help, and when they are good it can be rewarding for the students.
ReplyDeleteThanks Keni, I appreciate you sharing that with me I did not know. I find this interesting and I would agree that someone with as much experience as Lino can probably tell who is ready to teach and adjust. In a way is what Shanna says below, teachers find students who are advanced and then they find that these students in turn can help them or teach on their own.
ReplyDeleteIt is the way things are and I would agree that any of these teachers who learn this way are very respectful of lineage.
Brianna, I hear you. This used to happen to me all the time whenever I visited Buenos Aires in the early years, when I finally found a great teacher, regardless of authorization I felt like I was in heaven, someone could speak my language, and so on... Glad you had one of these angels who are out there teaching in spite of all odds and that you were able to take your first class that way.
ReplyDeleteHi Claudia, I have been doing my practice of ashtanga for almost 3 years now, about a year ago I attended a teacher training specific to the ashtanga primary series. In my eyes I went to the training to learn more of the details about the practice and to immerse myself deeper into my own practice rather than to learn to teach others. During that time because I was working with others I also ended up learning how to help others in their practice and how to learn to help myself from watching and listening to my peers.
ReplyDeleteI live in Las Vegas and we don't have access to a certified or authorized teacher in town. A couples of times a year we may get a special weekend workshop from whatever teacher is passing through and we jump at the chance to attend.
One day we had Kino and TIm come to town and after the asana practice was done they talked to us. Tim told us about how Lino Miele had told him and his friends to start a practice group, he said I can't be here to teach you all the time but if don't practice while I'm gone why should I come back to see you? So get together with your friends or anyone who enjoys ashtanga vinyasa and practice, then I'll come back to see you.
Kino and Tim inspired us to start a group just like all people used to do before there were yoga studios, we have a wonderful woman named Cheryl that lets us use her studio in the mornings and we just leave a small donation in return.
Anyone who is ever in town is welcome to come practice with us, or maybe start your own group in your town.
hi Claudia, i don't know where to post my question, so i just put it here for now. i broke my hand last week while ice-skating and of course the biggest dissapointment is that i cannot do yoga. I was doing ashtanga for a year now and am very upset. it's not just the hand but also post-operational stress, feeling down and lacking the will to do anything at all. It's the right hand. I don't know if I shoul do at least some poses which don't involve it or make a complete pause. It's been just a week since the operation. Any ideas? Many thanks! Irina
ReplyDeleteRoger, thanks for writing, i think that what you guys are doing is not only brilliant, it is an inspiration to anyone who may not have a studio nearby. Great idea from Tim and Lino and pad in the back to all of you for creating community around the love of the practice.
ReplyDeleteMy last trip to Las Vegas was too short to venture but next time I will try to join you guys, would love to practice there with all of you!